Big Black

interview by Bob Madigan in 1985 in Detroit, from Thrash and Other Trash issue 2

BOB - You have three releases out now, they're all 12 inches, would you like to talk about those?
STEVE - Well, I can give you the history of them. The first one I did all by myself when I was trying to put the band together, as sort of a search to find people to play in the band. After we got the band together, which was right after the first record came out, we started working on the second record, which is called "Bulldozer".

BOB - And the first one was called "Lungs," right?
STEVE - Right, then a year after that we put out a 12 inch called "Racer X" and that was our third release. Now we are waiting for the release of a single and an album on Homestead, both of which are finished. We also have two tracks that Cory Rusk is putting out for his label, Touch & Go. I think that's going to be finished in February. It's going to include us, the Butthole Surfers, Frightwig and Killdozer. We are very excited about being a record with Frightwig.

BOB - What's the scoop on Frightwig?
STEVE - Frightwig are an institution. They are the Supremes of the eighties, that's the way to put it.

BOB - What about the scene in Chicago, what are things like there?
STEVE - It's hell, let me tell you, it's a living hell.

BOB - Are the Effigies still big out there?
STEVE - No, definitely not very big. There are very few bands that have a big following in Chicago.

BOB - What about Out of Order? They played here this summer.
STEVE - Oh, God, everyone in Chicago loves them!
BOB - Yeah, there was a lot of violence at that show!
STEVE - If there is someone that deserves violence at their shows, I think it is Out of Order. They're a suburban hardcore punk rock band. They're a totally original outfit. They're not trying to copy anything from anybody. In their 16 and 17 years I'm sure they had to scrape by and really hustle to make ends meet. You know, allowance doesn't go as far as it used to. Having to borrow mommy's station wagon to go to practice is always a drag. Sometimes you get in trouble and for coming in late from a date and then you can't take mommy's station wagon anymore. No, actually, Chicago is a comfortable place to live. Good transportation, rents aren't particularly expensive. There are some good bands in Chicago, notably, End Result, Bloodsport, Urge Overkill, Pile of Cows, Oh No, and Naked Raygun. (at this point there is a knock at the door) You'll have to excuse me [LINE ILLEGIBLE]

LAURA - I just want to brush my teeth.
STEVE - We're just doing an interview, go right ahead.

BOB - Is there any kind of performance art in Chicago?
STEVE - Actually, Oh No and End Result are sort of the fringes of that.
BOB - Because as far as performance art here in Detroit--things are pretty much a cultural wasteland.
STEVE - I've heard about some things happening on Cass corridor.
BOB - I haven't heard about anything going on there for quite a while.
STEVE - Basically when you're missing performance art, you're not missing a whole lot, because even where it is really good, almost all of it is shit. The people involved in it will tell you that.

BOB - Would you like to talk about Pure magazine?
STEVE - Pure magazine, there is someone no one ever asks us about. People got really worked up in Chicago about the magazine called Pure. Because it's not a music fanzine or a comic book fanzine or a skull-drawing fanzine, it's just a fanzine about murder, violent sexual acts and Nazi atrocities. The guy that puts it out, that's just his taste. He just happens to think that this stuff is interesting, and because he doesn't beat around the bush or make any grand political statements about it, people think he is a fascist. I suppose he is a fascist, but the fanzine itself is pretty innocuous. It's kind of crazy, I'll give you that, but a lot of these punk rock type people aren't playing with a full deck either. It's all a matter of taste. If you think the Dead Kennedys are cooler or less offensive than Klaus Barbie, then that's your distinction. Anyways, I wrote an article on Pure magazine for Forced Exposure and now people are not only down on the magazine itself, they're down on me for writing about it. They think I'm tied up in this nebulous network of Nazis.

BOB - I thought the article was interesting, and I'd like to see a copy if you brought one along.
STEVE - No, I didn't. There are only two issues available. There was a third issue printed in Italy, but so far not a single issue has slipped past customs into the US. There is a fourth issue supposedly coming out with a video compilation. The fanzine itself is not nearly as shocking as thinking about it. It has great diaries, photographs and news accounts of violent deaths and sexual torture, punishment and all sorts of stuff. If you're interested in that kind of stuff--you know, I kind of like glancing through it, but I don't think it's dangerous. After all, it's only exposing things that really do exist and treating it the way most people treat a lot of things. If you write about skateboarding like it's the be all and end all of the world, no one really concerns themselves with it. But, if one happens to write about mass murder in the same fashion that a teeny-bopper wrote about skateboarding, then all of a sudden he's a Nazi and a fascist and is a dangerous person and he ought to be locked up.

BOB - Yeah, I read an interview with Monte Cazaza in Re/Search that sounds similar to that kind of attitude.
STEVE - The whole thing with Cazazza and the rest of the parts and following of Throbbing Gristle is handled a lot more intelligently. Whereas this guy from Pure just thinks things are funny. He gets a charge out of seeing people take advantage of other people. Personally, it's not my aesthetic. I can't say that it is any less valid a viewpoint than saying heavy metal is a good musical form, another thing I certainly don't agree with.

BOB - Are you planning any video projects?
STEVE - Hopefully we can do something with Cory Rusk in the same way that the Butthole Surfers did theirs.

BOB - Any closing statements from Big Black?
STEVE - I think everyone should be aware of Frightwig as an entity.
BOB - They're an all female band, aren't they?
STEVE - They just had a lineup change, so I'm not really sure. But they are in Europe right now. When they get back, they ought to be greeted with a hero's welcome. I'm not so sure that will happen. Cory Rusk is God as near as we can tell. Killdozer is God. Die Kreuzen is God, but they've been God for a while, everyone knows they are God. Butthole Surfers are God. I think everyone is sick of hearing that one, but I'm not sick of listening to them.
BOB - What about Big Black?
STEVE - We've been God once or twice. Sometimes we're really terrible. Hopefully tonight we won't be terrible.